Oswald in the doorway: the blog of the Oswald Innocence Campaign, by Ralph Cinque

Let's list the Top 8 reasons why Toni and Mrs. Glover had to be standing on the grass in the Dorman film:

1. the lack of elevation. They appear to be and are at the same level as the people in front of them. Recall that even when Toni demonstrated that she towered over a man who was on the sidewalk in front of her.

It would be the same if he was on the sidewalk facing Houston; she would tower over him.

2. they are very close to the sidewalk. The pedestal is and was continuous with the wall of the pool which was and his behind the grass.

It looks like they are just a little back from the edge of the sidewalk, and that's because they were. The pedestal is part of the wall of the pool, and a third of the narrow width of it projects into the pool.

 So, there was and is very little pedestal that projects beyond the wall of the pool. It gets nowhere near the sidewalk, which they were close to. They were just beyond the edge of the sidewalk.  

3. the line of the pedestal was continuous with the line of the wall of the pool. If they were standing on the pedestal side by side, then the line they make would be consistent with the line of the pool. Also note that the line of the pool is parallel with the line of the sidewalk. Therefore, if they were standing on the pedestal, then the line through them would extend rightward and become the line of the pool, which would be in parallel with the line of the sidewalk.

Very little of the pedestal projects beyond the line of the pool. So, even if they were on the very front edge of the pedestal (and everyone instinctively would stand in the center of it just as Toni Glover did when she posed on it in 2013) the line of the pool would not be very far behind them. And, it would be parallel with the line of the sidewalk. So, if they are on the pedestal, the pool line should be where the white line is on the right above.  

4. The very boisterousness of their activity in the Dorman film (both mother and daughter) proves that they were on solid ground. Even at that height, one would be uneasy about moving around very much. There's a sense of peril- even at that height. Notice that Toni looks very still, and she is looking down to keep her connection with the ground, and she has her hands on her hips with her elbows out, which helps to plant her weight firmly while it also broadens her to help her stay balanced. Notice also that her feet are spread apart.  She is widening herself, which is a more stable structure. And, she's doing all that without thinking about it consciously. Her instincts tell her to do it. 

Watch the Doorman film again and look how they're both practically dancing. They wouldn't do that on that pedestal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHS2KeOml88

It's like they are convulsing. They wouldn't do that on that pedestal.

5. This collage below proves that they were on the grass and not that far from the Main Street intersection because you can see the Main Street intersection.

At the top, you are seeing a car that is turning from Main, and at the bottom, you are seeing the arm of Mrs. Glover. So, how can they be at the Elm intersection if they are that close to Main?

6. After the limo passes them in the film, it travels a long way in a straight line before it reaches the Elm intersection and begins turning. So, how could they be at the Elm intersection? The limo would be turning as it reached them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHS2KeOml88

7. There is grass behind them, at least behind Toni, and that's impossible if she was on the pedestal. There would be nothing but water behind her if she was on the pedestal.

8. The fact that they resorted to a patently obvious fraud:

Cinque starts bellyaching and suddenly a thing like that shows up? People have been looking at the standard view of Toni waving at the President for decades.

I guarantee you that it never displayed any white stuff before, and I've been looking at it from various sources for years. This is just more of the same JFK chicanery. In 1966, Harold Weisberg bellyaches that Lovelady wore a short-sleeved shirt, and suddenly Gorilla Man shows up. In 2012, Ralph Cinque bellyaches that Black Hole Man has no face, and suddenly this shows up:

That does not occur in any authorized version of the Altgens photo. For goodness sake, I have one directly from the AP. I also have the October 1964 LIFE magazine with the Altgens photo and the enlarged crop of the doorway, which I have studied with a bright light and magnifying glass, and you certainly don't see that etching or anything like it. It's crap! The lying, cheating, bloodied Ops will do anything to keep their evil lies going. They are protecting the killers of JFK; it is their job to protect the killers of JFK. 

But, this issue of the Glovers in the Dorman film is way over the top, meaning way over the threshold of certainty. THEY WERE ON THE GRASS; THEY WERE NOT ON THE PEDESTAL. 

And that means the only way you can defend their pedestal sightings in Bell and Hughes is to claim that they ran and beat the limo down Houston Street to the pedestal, climbed atop it and then got situated on it to where Toni was waving towards Elm St. before Kennedy even made the turn from Houston. Good luck with that.