Oswald in the doorway: the blog of the Oswald Innocence Campaign, by Ralph Cinque

This was in response to bpunk on McAdams' forum. The punk is still trying to argue that Shelley and Lovelady were still standing out in front at the time Oswald departed for home. It included a reference to there being 3 or 4 mintues BEFORE Gloria Calvary reached Shelley and Lovelady at the entrance.   

But, it couldn't have been 3 or 4 minutes. You only have to read the testimony:

Mr. BALL - Now, when Gloria came up you were standing near Mr. Shelley? 
Mr. LOVELADY - Yeah. 
Mr. BALL - When Gloria came up and said the President had been shot, Gloria Calvary, what did you do? 
Mr. LOVELADY - Well, I asked who told her. She said he had been shot so we asked her was she for certain or just had she seen the shot hit him or--she said yes, she had been right close to it to see and she had saw the blood and knew he had been hit but didn't know how serious it was and so the crowd had started towards the railroad tracks back, you know, behind our building there and we run towards that little, old island and kind of down there in that little street. We went as far as the first tracks and everybody was hollering and crying and policemen started running out that way and we said we better get back into the building, so we went back into the west entrance on the back dock had that low ramp and went into the back dock back inside the building. 

There is no way that 3 or 4 minutes after the assassination that ANYBODY would have had doubt that Kennedy had been shot. Lovelady asked Gloria Calvary if she was certain, and he wouldn't have done that 3 or 4 minutes later. By the 3 to 4 minute mark, everybody and his brother knew full-well what had happened, and Lovelady would not have asked her if she was certain.  That conversation had to be mere seconds after the last shot. 

Furthermore, he describes seeing Baker climbing the steps AFTER the encounter with Gloria Calvary:

Mr. BALL - By the time you left the steps had Mr. Truly entered the building? 
Mr. LOVELADY - As we left the steps I would say we were at least 15. maybe 25. steps away from the building. I looked back and I saw him and the policeman running into the building. 
Mr. BALL - How many steps? 
Mr. LOVELADY - Twenty, 25. 
Mr. BALL - Steps away and you looked back and saw him enter the building? 
Mr. LOVELADY - Yes. 

By his own estimation, Marrion Baker reached the steps about 15 seconds after the last shot. So, Lovelady and Shelley were on their way, commencing their "trek to the tracks" BEFORE Baker reached the steps which they saw from some 20 steps away. 

Plus, Lovelady spoke about the throng of people who descended on the railroad tracks which they were part of. That happened immediately. It did not happen 3 or 4 minutes later. 

And, bpete is dead-wrong about the chronology of the Fritz notes. Fritz wrote 1st and put an arrow, and where the arrow points is: to first floor had lunch. And that is certainly what Oswald did first.

 Nobody in his right mind would claim that Oswald went down to the 1st floor and ate lunch AFTER the assassination. And if they try to claim it, they're going to be at odds with Vincent Bugliosi because Vince says Oswald did that at 12;15. So, eating lunch was the 1st thing that happened, and then below that is the second thing: out with Bill Shelley in front. Then, above that he wrote: claims 2nd floor Coke when Officer came in- even though that came later.  

So, how did it get scrambled? Why is it out of order? I suspect it was just the way the conversation went down. It just unfolded that way. Conversations aren't always chronological. They jump around. But, Fritz adjusted for it in his notes by putting 1st with an arrow.  

So, the chronological order was:

ate lunch in the 1st floor lunch room, pre-assassination
was out with Bill Shelly in front, during the assassination
went to the 2nd floor lunch room and encountered T&B
then, left work; nothing to be done that day, etc. 

That's it! And it's pretty straight-forward too. Only the bloodied would try to parse it any other way. 

Oswald NEVER said he was in the lunch room at the time of the shots. He said he was out with Bill Shelley in front at the time of the shots. There is nothing else he could have been referring to, and frankly, there is nothing else he could have been doing at the time of the shots.  

Shelley and Lovelady were not out front when Oswald left. If they were standing out front, how could they have avoided seeing Oswald?

Ball: Did you EVER see Oswald again THAT DAY after you broke for lunch?
Lovelady: NO. 

Mr. BALL. On November 22, 1963, the day the President was shot, when is the last time you saw Oswald? 
Mr. SHELLEY. It was 10 or 15 minutes before 12. 
Mr. BALL. Where? 
Mr. SHELLEY. On the first floor over near the telephone. 
Mr. BALL. Did you ever see him again? 

Mr. SHELLEY. At the police station when they brought him in.